O0ps, World Cup Handbook Features Old Croatian Flag

Its a better flag then the Fascist one they have these days.

Hope you enjoy watching the new one wave at the WC this year. I know the transition is hard on you these days. But cheer up you’ll get used to it.

ok..I’ll set the record straight. The ‘old flag’ has never been a Croatian Flag. It is a flag given to the ‘Republic of Croatia’ by the Yugoslavian authority between 1945 and 1990. Much like every US state and Canadian province has it’s own flag, this one was imposed upon the Croatian people by the Communist Regime.

The ‘current flag’ is the only flag ever to fly under the banner of Croatia. We are a new country, since 1991, and this is the only flag we have ever had.

We carried a state flag as well as a civil flag during the second world war, neither of which were recognized due to the unrest in Europe.

Hereth Endeth the Lesson.

The flag of Croatia with the checkerboard was first used during Croatia’s association with the Austro-Hungarian Empire. An example can be found online. Earlier the checkerbord shield pattern was used as early as the 15th century, an example of which is on the roof in tile in Zagreb on the Church of St. Mark’s along with the Kingdom of Croatia. During the Communist era on official documents was used the checkerboard shield in the official crest of the Republic of Croatia. That same crest starting with a red square is on the current flag since Croatia’s departure from Yugosalvia (whose constitution stated that any republic could leave Yugoslavia if it so wished although that obviously didn’t happen. Croatia is not a new country. It was first recognized as a Kingdom by Charlemagne. Later the Kingdom of Croatia accepted association with the crown of the Austro-Hungarian Empire as a distinct political entity. It was then put into the first Royalist Yugoslavia as one of three republics called the Kingdom of Croats, Serbs and Slovenes. During WWII it was the Independant State of Croatia. Then it was forced into the Communist Yugoslavia as an equal partner republic with the rest of the republics. No vote as to the people’s wishes was held at the end of WWII. It then voted freely in 1990 to be an independent country as recognized by all the nations in the United Nations. Croatia crowned its first king in the 10th century. It is certainly not a new country. The attempt to disparge the Croatian National team’s colors is a vitriolic attack on the players, the coaches, the fans and the country itself. It certainly has no place in sport. Lesson now over.

I think can all agree that we can look forward to watching Croatia on the pitch this summer. Should be fun.

Thank you Bob. I think we should enjoy all well-played and fair competition at the WC. The Croatian National team and Croatians have worked hard to attain recognition and status in the international arena. The Hajduk team in Split has been actively playing “futbal” since the 1890’s. There is a long tradition of the sport in Croatia. We don’t apprecicate backbiters trying to sully the image of our sportsmen. Good luck to all the teams, yes and even the Serbia and Montenegro representation.

Kapcro, I still don’t get if you’re agreeing or disagreeing with me.

But once again; Croatia as an independant state did not exist untill 1990 (with a small sting in 1941-1945). Up untill this time it was aways associated with a stronger empire(Byzantine, Austro-Hungarian). So, it may have been recognized as a Kingdom…but a Kingdom under the rule of Charlemagne.
Also, the AH deemed it as a seperate political entity ..under the rule and authority of the AH empire.

Friend, this issue revolves around plitical rights granted as a politicial entity within a greater association. Croatia existed and so did the people, the culture, the language and the state in whichever form it took. The AH empire at the time of the assination in Sarajevo had granted concessions to rename it the Austro-Hungarian-Croatian Kingdom. Yes equal billing. Unfortunately WWI broke out and that was never implemented. Within Yugoslavia it was a state within a federation. So my point stands that its been around alot longer than 1990.

Soze if you’d like a little erudition on the topic of Croatian Statehood and National Consciousness. I refer you to the multi-volume Croatian Encyclopodia, the two volume set Croatia, Land, People and Culture by Eterovich or The History of Croatia by Stjepan Gazi. If thats a little much try Wikepedia.

And there is a big difference between National Consciousness and an Autonomous State as recognized by others. I have never seen a Croatian flag other that the one we proudly support now.

You can avoid that I state Croatian Statehood if you like. Amazing those volumes I stated can write a history from the 7th century of a nation, country, state, republic, kingdom or whatever you want to call Croatia that only exists from 1990. As far as the flag issue go to Zeljko-Heimer-Fame.from Hr/hrvat/index.HTML and look up zastava (flag) Trojedno Krajlevstvo Hrvatske, Slavonije i Dalmacije 1848, 1867-1918 and Banovina Hrvatske u Kraljevini Jugoslavije 1939-41. This points out that the flag used today has no fascist relation and that, to you, there were other Croatian flags used. As far as soccer is concerned the HNK Hajduk soccer club was formally registered in Split in Feb. 1911 by not Austro-Hungarians but by yes Croatians within the Kingdom of Croatia, Slavonia and Dalmatia as recognized by the Autro-Hungarian Empire, same as the partner state the Hungarian Kingdom was recognized. Soccer was played informally as early as th 1890s in yes Croatia. Go to the HNK Hajduk website for their historial archives pictures posted on the web for proof of people speaking Croatian in a country, state, nation, kingdom whatever you wish to call it kicking a soccer ball around that early. The definition of federation as defined by Webster is “the formation of a political “unity” by a number of separate states, each of which retains control over its own internal affairs”. Croatia was such a separate political state within the Yugoslav federation. It chose like other states in this federation to extricate itself in 1990. Croatians have played in international play under the federation flag of Yugoslavia but that does not negate Croatia’s existence as a republic. Republic defined by Webster’s as “a state in which the supreme power rests in the body of citizens entitled to vote and is exercised by representatives chosen directly or indirectly by them”.

Hey guys, let’s agree to disagree and move on to talking about how Croatia goes about trying to beat Brazil.

The way to beat Brazil is blood, guts and sweat and a few lucky bounces.

lol….hear hear.

Let’s not forget Croatia teid against brazil in a friendly in 2005 and actually beat argentina (including the lights of messi) in 2006. So i think Croatia is going to stur up a riot once again!!!

hi, I too agree that Croatia is an idependent country now and should not be associated with Yugoslavia and the Communist rule. We should forget the unfortunate parts of our history.

Also, I would like to contact any Croatians living in Cyprus.

Anyone wanting to contact send me an email on ZrInKa2990@yahoo.com

Bob, sorry but the “slip” FIFA had printing the former Yugoslavian flag as Croatia’s flag has a much greater sting then you make it seem. It is the equivalent of a slap in the face and a kick to the gut. Croatia fought long and hard for her Independence from communism and the opression of Serbia. People allways associate mass graves and war crimes happening in Bosnia, and forget that it happened in Croatia as well. I visted Croatia a few months after the Dayton Peace Accord- I saw the craters the bombs left. I saw the houses burned out. I saw the pock marks that the heavy shelling left on the hospital and school walls. I drove down the highways and saw the crops rotting in the fields because they had not been demined yet. I heard the horror stories that people had gone through. So do not think that Croatians will merely forgive and forget FIFA’s mistake. Crotians are proud of their freedom and what they had to endure during the war. Imagine how America felt when they won their Independence from England, and you will realize the patriotism Croatians feel for their country. No, they NEVER want to go back to how it was.

And Zrinka, I disagree that we should forget about the more unfortunate parts of our history. We must remember what happened and why it happened. We must remember in order not to repeat the sins of our forefathers.

Anyhow I’ll get off of my soap box now. bok